Re: Can you prove god? (apparently not)

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: : I know this was meant to be a joke, but it's kinda lame, so I'm going to take it seriously too. Plus I think you tried to be serious to begin with. : What have you all got against cheese sandwiches anyway? : : : The reason behind the belief in God is centred around 'faith'. 'Faith' is believing without any tangible proof. This gets back to a central point in my contention. If there is actual proof God exists, this would prove that there is no God as such proof would deny free-will. : : Well.... faith is a big part of the Christian religion, but not everything as you say. When Jesus rose from the dead, that would've been pretty conclusive. : If that event actually did happen, it proves that God is willing to perform miracles. Why do no miracles of that extent occur at present. This all goes back to my free-will argument, which I will eventually get round to posting in the fullness of time. Jesus rising from the dead is good, but it must be taken in the context of that time period and with impartial witnesses. : : : Given that the choices are 'believe in God' and go to heaven, or 'disbelieve in God' and go to hell, is that even a rational choice once it has been proven beyond doubt that God exists? : : Revise facts pleez. : Will get to later. : : : : These points are made in the assumption that God is non-interventionalist, and takes no credence whatsoever in those who have personally been touched by God. (requires more discussion of free-will which will be discussed in the fullness of time) : : Always in the fullness of time. : Patience is its own reward. : : : However, bearing all this in mind, I will attempt to do the impossible and prove categorically there is a God by sheer logic alone. : : : 1+1+1+1+1+A=10+1+1+1+1 : : : If we assume A = 9, then the equation is correct. Thus, believing A to be 9 renders the whole equation correct. However, isn't it more likely to conclude that if A does not equal 9, it is the entire equation which is placed in doubt? : : : Just one small element renders the large equation worthless if incorrect. Now apply this biblically. : : I like taking this seriously. Most of us did algebra at school. I did 3 years after, but enough on me. If A is not equal to 9 then the equation wouldn't exist in the first place because it's an IMPOSSIBILITY. : : Which moron came up with this equation where A doesn't equal 9? Oh sorry. : I thought that was my point. Lets look at the larger picture. Why does the equation necessarily have to make sense? If A just equalled A and not 9, than the equation is wrong. : But, calm down, I've already conceded that this is a poor example. : : : So how can we prove that God really exists without assuming God actually exists? : : : Well, obviously we'll need to make some more assumptions. : : : Lets start with: : : : a) a cheese sandwich is better than nothing : : Depends. I like cheese sandwiches. But I don't like blue vein cheese. So I wouldn't be so emphatic about cheese sandwiches. : So you'd prefer nothing? : : : b) nothing is better than ultimate fulfilment : : Is it? Are you telling me that if I were to offer you ultimate fulfillment you would rather nothing? (sorry, but the joke is old) : No, I'd rather a cheese sandwich. : : : c) thus: a cheese sandwich is better than ultimate fulfilment. : : Yes,yes it all makes sense now. : Glad, you're paying attention. : : : Now that we've established a cheese sandwich is better than ultimate fulfilment, we must ponder how a cheese sandwich was created. : : But is it not the nothing around the cheese sandwich that makes it really something? We must ponder the existance of the nothing. : You're missing the point, you should be pondering the cheese sandwich. : : : Can man create a cheese sandwich by himself? : : : No, he requires dairy products and grain. : : : Can the process of evolution result in naturally occuring bread and cheese slices? : : : Obviously not. : : : a) We know that God acts as a pathway to 'ultimate fulfilment'. : : What about Robbie Williams? : I don't correlate Robbie Williams to ultimate fulfilment, but if that's what turns you on, go with it :) : : : b) By process of elimination, if its not the act of nature that has created this work of art known as a 'cheese sandwich', then surely it comes from another source. : : Again you're forgetting Robbie Williams. : I think that was intentional. : : : c) Thus, we can assume that cheese sandwiches exist as a creation designed to prove the ultimate existence of God. : : And Robbie Williams. : I'm pretty sure Robbie Williams exists, although often I would rather he didn't. : : : : Soo many examples and so forth take the stand: It cant possibly be "evolution" (for example) THEREFORE God exists. Thats crazy talk. I am a very rational person, and as far as i can see God is a fanciful dream that would be wonderful if it was true, but the only evidence i see is "It must be true". : : : Never underestimate the power of denial :) : : I will not never underestimate the power of denial. : Don't you find not using double negatives is a confusing and nonsensical way in order to not establish a point? : : : If you don't believe me, I'll tell you I heard that line in a movie, thus 'It must be true'. : : Yeah, movies are full of deep religious stuff. Like that Shrek movie where he says he has many layers like an onion. Deep man. : You can find religion anywhere, if you look hard enough. Personally, I find it in cheese sandwiches. It appears, you find it in Robbie Williams. That's what makes it such a wonderful, wacky world. : : : : Why? : : : Because... : : he is trying to say he's not one dimensional and you shouldn't judge a book by it's cover and never mind. : For the love of God and my sanity, can we please get off this topic of algebra, and cheese sandwiches? : If you found it funny? Good. : If you found it confusing? Good. : If you hated it? Good. : At least I see some thinking going on :) : From the sublime to the ridiculous....

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